you bought two properties with them, and why is now the campuses george washington university, sold one of those, but another home. that wealth, as we know, real estate isn't just a driver of wealth in america, it's the wealth. so, without access to education, they go on to be teens of colleges, including howard university. samantha relatives would own property that they would give to lincoln university. the first hbcu. so, this wasn't only changing his families trajectory, but black america's trajectory. >> this podcast reminds the historical fact i think both people don't realize, we've had reparations in this country. it's just that they went to the slave holders, not to the slaves. >> that is mind-blowing for a lot of people. we gave reparations to this labor's. >> it's extraordinary. >> that does it for the saturday addition of morning joe: weekend. we'll see you right here tomorrow, at six a.m.! msnbc's the weekend starts right now. ♪ ♪ ♪

good morning, it is saturday, february 24th. i militiamen this, with symone sandra townsend and michael steele. it is up difficult moment in the republican primary. polls are officially open in south carolina. congressman james clyburn is going to join us. plus, the former head of the nra found liable for corruption, another victory for the new york a.g.. and it is official. donald trump now owes more than 400 and $54 million in fraud judgment. the clock is ticking for him to pay up, and that juice is running. grab your coffee, settle in, welcome to the weekend. >> since today is an election day and they love nothing more than an election date, let's get right to the man of the hour, msnbc national political correspondent, steve kornacki, for us, live at the big board. >> good morning, and for those

of you in south carolina who are out there voting, happy primary day! so, here it is. donald trump, nikki haley, it's basically been eight months now since the new hampshire primary that donald trump won by 11 points now. the action shifts to haley's home state here, south carolina. the polling certainly has shown donald trump with a commanding, in many cases, overwhelming lead heading into today. obviously, if haley is going to turn this race around, she's gonna pull a big surprise tonight. so, some of the places we're going to be looking at the vote comes in tonight, first for haley, her strength has been, we've talked about this, it's been with independents. it's been with democrats. this is an open primary. there's no primary registration in south carolina, so anybody can vote, as long as they didn't vote in the democratic presidential primary, which was held three weeks ago. not a big turnout in that one. so, there's a pretty large universe, at least in theory, if available voters for nikki haley. places to look for nikki haley tonight, chief among them is

charleston. charleston county here. this is an area. take a look back at the 2016 presidential primary, where donald trump won south carolina, but he lost to his county. so, this is a blue county in general elections, this area of the state, to, this county, very high median income, high concentration of college degrees, high concentration of the types of independent and democratic voter who might haley hopes turnout for her. in addition to the type of republican voter, that's college, no college divide. we talk about that a lot. you can definitely see that places a like charleston, charleston county south carolina. you can see and next door and buford county as well. those higher income, suburban you know, voters with college degrees within the republican party, those are the ones who tend to be more skeptical of trump, more hostile to trump, more open to haley. so, you've got to look, she needs a big margin down here she. needs to win charleston county. obviously, she needs to win it by a big margin. she also needs before cavity. this is where hilton head is, for instance. another place to look for haley,

that would be state capital, richland county. that's where colombia's. again, trump lost this county. he only lost two counties in 2016. charleston and columbia were to. they are pretty big counties, especially richland, and again, demographically, very similar here within the republican primary. so, those are places haley has to brought it up. trump, i look for particular strength in trump in the upstate. a lot of the counties here, this is actually the biggest county, greenville, a lot of counties in the upstate very, very high concentrations of evangelical voters. remember, we saw in iowa, evangelical voters have been skeptical of trump eight years ago, have really become part of his coalition. really look for a big trump number appear. so, we'll see when the polls close, what starts happening. here is the basic challenge that nikki haley is facing right here. it's this. remember, in the new hampshire primary a month ago, she had overwhelming support from the democrats who participated, people who call themselves democrats, and from

independents. she won independence by almost 20 points in new hampshire. that independents and democrats combined, this is shocking when you think about it. 50% of the new hampshire republican primary election we're not republicans. they call themselves independents, they call themselves democrats. that's where haley even made it somewhat competitive, but she still lost by 11 points within an electorate that was half democrats and independents. take a look at south carolina. we've seen in past primaries here, that's a combination of independents and democrats looked last time around, it was 24%. that's half of what we saw in new hampshire. 29%. 20%. this is the big one. this is the most non republican, south carolina republican electorate and suburban back in 2000, and george will be bush, john mccain, it was 39% combined. independents and democrats. again, that's 11 points short of what we just saw a month ago in new hampshire. that in new hampshire was not enough for nikki haley.

this is the highest we independent then democratic chair has ever been in south carolina. i think, frankly, if nikki haley has a prayer of pulling off what would be a monumental upset, she's got to bring this number, this combination of independents and democrats, she's got to bring that up to levels never before seen in south carolina, and she's got to turn them out an absolute droves. that's what, part of her campaign, certainly has been trying to do, because the big problem for haley continues to be, we saw it in new hampshire, iowa d.c., in all the polling. folks who call themselves republicans, court republican voters, have been overwhelmingly saying they support donald trump. people by 15 points. he won republicans by 50 points in new hampshire. haley won the independents and the democrats by crushing margins. she just needs an astronomical turnout from them. >> all right, steve kornacki, as always, thank you so much. we're gonna see a lot of you today. >> i know. i'll be watching the big board, as voters cast their ballots in

south carolina, donald trump's already looking for that general election. he is making a new pitch to win over black voters. here is what he said last night at a gala for black conservatives happening in south carolina. >> these lights are so bright in my eyes that i can't see too many people out there. but i can only see the black ones. i can't see any white ones, you see? that's how far i've come. under my administration, black americans prosper like no time in the history of our country. [applause] we achieve the lowest african unemployment rate ever recorded. the black people are so much on my side now, because they see what's happening to me happens to them! because, does that make sense? we've all seen the mugshot, and you know embraced it more than anybody else? the black population. it's incredible. you see, black people walking around with my mugshot, you, know they do stewards, they sell them for $19 apiece.

>> [laughter] hey, everybody. first of all, garrett, thanks for getting up early. garrett, what is going on in south carolina? >> well, look. let me take a moment to talk about the black voters part of this, to. i think it's important for the general election. donald trump knows he can never win black voters. joe biden won 92% of black voters in 2020. but if donald trump can't make that like, 85% or 80% win for joe biden, you could be the next president of the united states. that's how important black voters are to the democratic coalition. every voter he peels off with anything he throws of the ball, whether it be comments about discrimination or trying to make an economic appeal, or using the border a sort of a tool to try to win over black voters, anything that works on the margins, they think works for them. now, black voters are not expected to be a main part of the coalition in this republican primary here. in south carolina this morning, but donald trump largely feels

like he's got this seven up. i'm in columbia right now. every voter i've talked to coming in and out, highly unscientific process, has been a trump voter. this party has changed. this state has changed since nikki haley to the governor's mansion, and trump is hoping he can turn the page on her political career with a big win here. maybe something north of 30 points, i think, would be kind of the statement win like they had in the first two early contests. >> garrett, the comments the president made to that room, what was the reaction inside the room? because for what i could hear from the clip, it wasn't this overwhelming yes. it was like oh, okay. is that what we're doing now? the idea that he could stand in front of a black audience and make comments 00, i can't see anybody, you know, because the white lights are too bright, but i could see the black people. i don't know how that translates to that room. what was the feedback?

what did you hear from that? >> michael, here's the thing. in that room, i mean, this is sort of a self selected audience. this was like i love her black conservative foundation here in south carolina. this is a room full of trump supporters, right? so i think this is a different audience than the broader audience that he's trying to reach. well there's a little bit of an oh, shrug it off, that's how trump talks in the room, when these clips are played around the country to that broader african american audience who he is desperately trying to make some inroads with, i think that's when you have the real problem here. you know, folks across the racial spectrum, whose side they are with trump, there is a sense of forgiveness of the manner in which he talks that the folks he is desperately trying to convince to get off the fence, or activate, maybe people who are kind of low voter i.d., not particularly involved politically, who's trying to coax into the general election electorates, it becomes a lot harder to shrug off the kind of just odd tone to comments like that presented

outside of the context of kind of the friendly room he wasn't. >> and because garrett hague. love, thank you so much, garrett. good to have you on, man. joining us now, through mckissick,'s state chairman of the south carolina republican party. mister chairman, it is a real treat to have you in the house and at the table. welcome. >> sure. good to be with you. >> mister chairman, i'm wondering, what is your reaction to the comments from former president donald trump last night at that conservative rally in south carolina? >> well, i wasn't there, and there wasn't able to hear all the audio in what you're talking about here just a minute ago. >> oh, i'm so sorry, mister chairman! let me play the clip for you. can we play the clip of the president trump's matchup? let's play it for you. so sorry. hold on one second. i'll play. and >> these lights are so bright in my eyes that i can't see too many people out there. but i can only see the black ones. i can't see any white ones, you see? so far, that's how far i've come.

>> your reaction, sir? >> look, if at this point, everyone doesn't know when donald trump speaks and has spoken since he came on scene and 15 that they haven't been in this country very long. donald trump is like a billionaire construction worker. that's the way he talks. and if we haven't gotten used to that, they're not going to. so, the fact, as you get a room full of people there, as was pointed out a minute ago. so, their conservative. three black conservatives engaged in our party, who support the president, they invited him to come be there, and i'm sure enjoyed having him there last night. and here we are today, in south carolina, where we have what has been, since 1980, then the state that any republican who's going to win the white house has to win. and these people are engaged in trump's campaign. they're very involved in. it's -- got a large coalition of african-american supporters, spanish americans supporters, you go through the list. elected officials in south

carolina or seeing record enthusiasm here. what hasn't been talked about yet, and i saw your reporters going through the big board there in minute ago, it's the early vote here in south carolina. so, the total of the early votes came in at the end of the day on thursday. our total statewide was 200,000, 200,000 votes. democrats only had 132,000 people statewide vote in their primary, and that was after jim clyburn and joe biden go to the length of giving them a first- in-the-nation primary, and that's all the people they can muster to get excited about voting democrat? we beat them by 70,000 votes before we even get to the primary day here. the record we've had here in this primary with 765 thousands. that was in 2016, and then predicting today we're going to beat that number. >> mister chairman, i appreciate what you just said a moment ago about south carolina , since 1980. i am a student of south carolina, my family is from south carolina, columbia, orangeburg,

st. matthews. so, i'm very familiar. i've spent a lot of time growing up there. one thing i noted when i was national chairman was demographically, south carolina is changing. it is part of what has been termed the new south. it is a growing political force. georgia is another good example. north carolina began this trend, and virginia, about 20 years ago. to that's point, when i was chairman, i tried to upend our primary process a little bit, take some people off the side of the party, which famously known for doing, but the reality of it was that what you just said is important. south carolina is the new frontier for political engagement and setting up national general election winds. the democrats figured it out, that's why they switched. they made that push. what do you see going forward, a south carolina's role? given what you just said, that's creating this new political landscape where the combination

of black voters, white voters, independent voters, democrats, coming together can be a good coalition for republicans in their primary, which feeds a general election? >> i would say just a couple things real quick about that. number one, i think the reason we have that track record is because we are the most representative coalition of republicans within this state off the republican coalition nationally in a lot of ways. we've got social conservatives, fiscal conservative, populist conservatives, national security foreign policy conservatives. a big percentage of retired veterans here in the state, and when you add all that up statewide, we're very representative of the republican coalition nationally, in a lot of ways. i think that's another reason why we get it right. but further, as that coalition has expanded, we have grown in the state. so, we have gone from, you know, in the days of the 70s, where they didn't even print republican or democrat in the legislative manual, because everyone was a democrat, to a

supermajority in the states house, every single statewide elected official, both senators, six out of seven congressmen, a sandra, and more and more local elected officials,. the biggest is just to give you all those last to show the growth here, and the growth of that coalition, is that ticket voted. we are one of the states are still straight ticket voting. we never beat democrats on straight ticket voting until 2016. we beat them by two points. in 18, we beat them by eight points, and 20, we beat them by 17 points. in 22, we beat them by 27 points. statewide, straight ticket voting, the bottom has dropped out of the democratic party won't well local races around the state. more of those people are flipping parties, switching parties. which means seeing, in many cases, local elected officials who are conservative democrats and independents who are switching parties, all make another prediction to you today. i think when the networks do their exit polls and we see the cross tabs and all the self i.d. questions, i predict you will see a greater percentage of self i.d.'d who will probably vote for donald trump here in

south carolina. >> all right. mister chairman, appreciate your time very much. i'm looking forward to watching south carolina emerge as the first-in-the-nation primary someday. next, we'll be joined by the chair of the democratic party in south carolina to respond, as the haley campaign hopes to democrats and independents show up today, as the chairman noted, that's going to be an interesting test. you're watching the weekend. te you're watching the weekend. buty was her irritated skin. so, we switched to tide pods free & gentle. it cleans better, and doesn't leave behind irritating residues. and it's gentle on her skin. tide free & gentle is epa safer choice certified. it's got to be tide. pain hits fast. so get relief fast. only tylenol rapid release gels have laser drilled holes. they release medicine fast for fast pain relief. and now, get max strength topical pain relief precisely where you need it. with new tylenol precise. (ella) fashion moves fast. setting trends is our business.

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families -- show up to support her in her home state today. eight pro kayleigh super pac sent democrats this reminder, letting them know they can vote in today's primary if they didn't vote in the democratic primary earlier this month. joining us now, crystal spade, chair of the south carolina democratic party. welcome, madam chair. it's good to have you. >> thank you so much. >> you want to take the first? one -- no, you go. >> let's talk about the game plan here. we just have the chairman, we can, zeke on talking about the republican primary and noting that the significant number of democrats who are coming out today are going to be voting for donald trump. how do you see the landscape playing out from the democrats perspective, and what you

expect nikki haley is going to be this big push to get this over her? >> listen, democrats know exactly who nikki haley isn't who she isn't. she is, as i've been following her, the mother of maga. she spent years promoting a very extreme agenda as governor of south carolina. she signed extreme abortion ban into law. she refused to expand medicaid, which forced you know, the hospital in her own hometown to close. she supports gutting social security and medicare. democrats don't support that. democrats, those aren't democratic values. so, democrats are not going to show up to save nikki haley from donald trump. >> i'm sure you have seen, there's new reporting from nbc news about a gop efforts to courts black voters. let me read just a little bit of that for you. a conservative group founded by anonymous donors sent mailers to approximately 75,000 democratic primary voters in south carolina, heavily black electorate, head of the february 3rd primary there,

criticizing biden over his administration's push to ban mental cigarettes. so first, your response to the fact that that is the issue that they chose to focus on? and two, i think we all get the idea here isn't for republicans to win the black vote, is simply to siphon off in the black voters, enough latino voters, to start cutting into democrats. they wonder for state leaders like yourself, what you see as the message that needs to go to those traditionally democratic base voters to make sure, as we look towards the general, they are motivated and showing up. >> you know, but we have been doing since before the primary in february, letting democrats know what the vitamin harrison ministration has done for them, how they deliver, i don't think they believe the republican attempts are working, because what we see from there early vote numbers as of yesterday, the 2000 207,000 votes that were cast, we have information that shows about 6000 of those voters were black. so, i don't believe their

outreach is working. what we're telling democrats is that democrats have been delivering for them, for the last four years. president biden and vice president harris have delivered transformative legislation with the hbcu, all their hbcu investments. it's south carolina's, the home of hbcus, so we feel that the impact of that investment, the infrastructure bill, you know, south carolina has been crumbling under republican rule for decades. now, it's taken a democratic president to start fixing our roads and bridges, and start creating jobs for our community. so, democrats have been delivering, and that's what we have been constantly telling our voters. >> crystal, it's symone. i'm wondering, look, you have been the party chair in south carolina for a while. you've been operative in south carolina for a very long time. what are folks saying on the ground, and frankly, what are your fellow party chairs across the country talking to you

about? what are you almost concerned about as we look towards a general election? >> you know, making sure that our voters have information. what i've been saying is i don't see and enthusiasm gaps, and that susie has some gap with our voters. i see an information gap. making sure that what i've said about all of the accomplishments, all the successes that people can feel at their kitchen table can feel and see inside their community, that information is getting back to them that this is because of democrats. so, i feel like that's what we talk about the most. how do we continue to engage our voters and get them ready to vote to reelect joe biden in november? >> i do wonder if you think, after this, it is over for nikki haley. if, as the trump team said, north of 30%, they think that is the margin that does nikki haley in? >> i don't know what nikki haley's strategy is. all i know is democrats are not going to save her from donald trump.

she support donald trump, and she's get what she's gonna get. >> crystal spayed, thank you so much for being with us this morning. >> perfect way to end it, chairwoman. >> for the next hour, thank you. in the next hour, south carolina congressman james clyburn will join us to talk about the primary, and after the break, we need to talk about donald trump's comments about black voters. you're watching the weekend. black voters. you're watching the weekend. an s it won't. hair that feels deeply nourished, soft and lightweight. new herbal essences. bombas makes absurdly comfortable underwear. made to move with you, not on you. because your basic things should be your best things. one purchased equals one donated. visit bombas.com and get 20% off your first order.

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yeah, this conversation is almost time. turning the table is dr. jason, perfect your politics and journalism at morgan state university and host of the slate podcast. a word. welcome, my brother. you have a word for us this morning. so, i just want to put in the middle of the table here, it's like a big croissant, right? all flaky and ready to talk about, because when you bite into, it is nasty as heck. and that's what we heard from donald trump in south carolina. what is your reaction to this

conversation in front of a room of african americans, in which, in my estimation, he sounded ignorant. >> he doesn't just sound ignorant, he felt like trump. this is the same guy he's been through lots 25 or 30 years. he just emasculated him scott earlier this week, basically said you've been both jangling dancing for me and weeks. he did a better job talking at me than you, so, why are we surprised he gets in front of a room of black people and treat some like idiots, treat some like they are lucky to be there? the thing that got me, honestly, michael, i didn't see any trump force one. sets what i was looking for. i was like, black people, i thought we were gonna vote for trump, because you get a new pair of sneakers out. but none of this is shocking. i don't think any of the people there expect any better of him, because if you're voting for donald trump and you actually want to show up at a place where you claim to be a christian, and want to vote for donald trump, you've already lost. you're not a voter that can be talked to recent with or half much expectations. >> right. so, i don't expect much from

the people in the room, but i do think that just because donald trump has been saying and, frankly, the fact that donald trump has been like this for so long and he has not every course corrected, is as much of an indictment, i think, on our political discourse and the coverage of him that the people standing in that room. i just, first of all, he called the president racist, on top of everything. he said joe biden was racist. he said black people can identify with me, because i, too, they're telling me i've been discriminated against. like, he talked about the fact a lot of black people are buying a mugshot shirt and pointing them and selling about themselves. they are with me. i don't know a lot of people who bought them buckshot shirts. donald trump has been four times indicted, 91 counts, only recently have a mugshot is because of the black dea in fulton county and the black sherif that made sure he got one, to ensure that he knew that he was not above the law. so, it is disgusting. it is offensive.

i was gravely offended by the south carolina party chair, with the republican party chair who said, i, mean if you don't know by now, if i know by now,? what >> -- >> what am i supposed to expect? what am i exposed to accept? when the sneakers come out, we didn't say it on the show, we said it and the break. we were talking, oh, this is really offensive, because they think bucky will gonna vote for them for sneakers. then, people go on fox news and say black people don't vote for sneakers! at this point, black americans deserve and elevated discourse. do they not think blackmon care about the economy? the sneakers, as we were talking about last month, and menthol cigarettes. >> oh my god. >> yeah. that's all we do. we wear gold lemay sneakers, and we smoke menthol cigarettes. oh, and we have mugshot, to. >> you have to understand, bo. this is a room a very unique kind of black folk. it's a bunch of bad lineups of members on the jackets, right? that's what we're dealing with. so, i'm not surprised the sorts

of people accept that. these are the same people who listened to killer mike. these are the same people who listened to any top podcasts. are the same national black folks listen to joe rogan. these people are out there. unless concerns with anyone who is okay with trump's racism than i am with the people who are so disconnected from the process they are not worried about his racism. those people are more of a concern for me than the people voted for him. >> this is his pitch, though, the sneakers, with this, yes, he was speaking to the broom, but the cameras were there. he was speaking to black people across the country. these are their talking points. this is what it is. let's just be clear about donald trump struggle for black people, because around. down under trump, the black unemployment rate went up in the uninsured rate went up. his tax force reinforced discrimination. that typical household got double the cut of a black household. the covid response was disproportionately affected black people, left us dead. disproportionately affected black-owned businesses. they closed. he pushed to bring back stop and frisk, like, we need to go back to central farc five. there is a list here.

i could go on. >> especially because he's never let the truth get in the way of good story, right? of course he was going to go up there and spin his record. that's what he, thousands of every group. i think they were all trying to figure out, is he not trying to win the black vote, he's trying to siphon off enough black voters and created permission structure, where it may say, you may have voted for democrats all your life, but it is okay for you to vote for me, which is what i'm more curious about how democrats than counter that narrative. >> how they close that permission. >> here's the thing. there is no permission structure. i don't think, my personal philosophy on, this my intellectual philosophy on this, it ain't about switching votes. okay, donald trump, killer, mike any of his servants, and he -- >> can he go home? >> it's about keeping people home. it's about saying joe biden is terrible, i'm terrible, your life has changed. >> it's the impression. >> -- he's not trying to switch anybody over, try to get you the stay home. >> it's voter suppression tactic. in 2016, he won 8% black voters . 2020, again, 8% black voters. the last election, he got about eight, i do believe, 9% of

black voters. to the point that garrett made at the top of the show, if it's the margins that matter here, because this is going to be a close election. and if donald trump is able to, instead of getting 8%, maybe he takes up to 12 or 13, or that and the suppression of some black votes is enough people to stay home. i encourage people to, because i have black men in my life we voted for donald trump in 2016. okay? my husband is not one of them, because my house was from south carolina, my husband is not one of them! want to be clear, my man is not one of them! but in 2016, i know black people who voted for donald trump. , so i am not shocked or surprised when i do encourage people to do is do the research. is not true donald trump has the lowest unemployment rate ever for black people. that happened under joe biden, april 2023. it's not true that he has stung the most for hbcus. i have the number, joe biden, this administration. do your research, folks. give a quick google search, because i can't.

it is offensive. it is offensive, it is offensive, and for law epel to continue to write thing pieces and parse what he said, it's like, oh this is just trump. it's a play for black voters. is so unserious. so unserious! do we not desire? more and it, if black history month! >> to quote succession, these are not serious people. it never happened. but what i was look at when i look athe rising majority in this country. it ain't gonna fall on the shoulders of black people as to whether or not joe biden gets elected. but people who are not being discussed enough are the increasingly conservative young asian and latino men, in places like texas and arizona and colorado. that's going to be the difference. while everybody sit-ins has this laser focus on black man, you've got latino men who are working at the border who are like hey, i don't want these immigration issues. why is nobody talking about me?

you've got asian american men who are saying hey, wait a minute, i don't think affirmative action is worked for me. we have to focus on the wrong group of people. no matter if every single black person and always, always and 12, 13% of black voters who ended up voting republican and the way, if every single black man in america who voted for trump went and voted for joe biden this time, it ain't gonna change much. >> i don't think that's true. >> but i'm telling you, even in a place like georgia, right, worse is a very, very small margin, but most of those black man, it's not going to end up making a difference. if we look at latino men, if we look at asian men, that's where the difference is. that's where the focus needs to be. that democrats have to have a pivot to different kinds of people and stop talking to folks who are 55 60 years old, to listen to what an old rapper has to say, because their votes are already decided. it's those 18, 19 year olds working right now at cvs and verizon who don't see a difference for the ones who either stay home or switch their votes. >> the internet gonna be on fire while about what you said about blackmon, jason. i want to get your mentions ready. jason, sticking around, y'all.

after the break, a jury finds that the former head of the nra, well, will spend millions of dollars while leading the group. we've got more on the weekends. we've got more on the weekends. migraine attacks, all in one. don't take if allergic to nurtec. allergic reactions can occur, even days after using. most common side effects were nausea, indigestion, and stomach pain. ask about nurtec odt. there's nothing better than a subway series footlong. except when you add on an all new footlong sidekick. we're talking a $2 footlong churro. $3 footlong pretzel and a five dollar footlong cookie. every epic footlong deserves the perfect sidekick. order one with your favorite subway series sub today. - i got the cabin for three days. it's gonna be sweet! owhat? i'm 12 hours short.te - have a fun weekend. - ♪ unnecessary action hero! unnecessary. ♪ - was that necessary? - no. neither is a blown weekend. with paycom, employees do their own payroll so you can fix problems before they become problems. - hmm! get paycom and make the unnecessary, unnecessary.

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yup, that's how you business differently. breaking it last night, former and current leaders of the national rifle association, or nra, have been found liable for mishandling finances in their civil corruption trial. a new york jury found the former ceo, wayne lapierre, diverted millions of dollars from the group to fund lavish vacations and a luxurious lifestyle. that verdict is another victory for the new york attorney general, tissue james, who accused the nra leaders of breaking state laws to enrich themselves. jason johnson is back with us. tish james is on a roll. she don't miss. >> i'm impressed. i'm impressed. she's done her job, kept herself out of trouble, which we can't say for other attorneys and important places in this country right now.

but i think there's a larger issue here about what the role of the nra is, and why this is even possible. they basically put themselves out of business, they were so effective. which is what made them vulnerable to finally having this investigation. for me, the last couple years, the nra is like vcr repairmen. you don't need them anymore. they're obsolete. they've gotten so many republicans and republican leadership to buy into their philosophies that guns are more important than children that they don't have to do their job anymore. >> it's no longer just a love agave. it's -- >> they >> won their argument, so, now all they had to do was sit around and spend money and make it rain in the club, and now, they're all in trouble. i think dish james has done a fantastic job. i wish she could dissolve the entire organization, but i'm not surprised by this. i would say, though, the one thing i found most concerning about these reports, they didn't even have a whistleblower within the nra. that's indicative of how a lot of conservative organizations work. we're gonna do what ever we want to do, then, we're gonna press you and abuse you in the organization if you try to call us out for not following this. >> you saw the latest news out

of alabama around -- reckon it's aukus later in the show. i want to sort of zoom out and talk with you about some of the reporting we've seen about white christian nationalism. really being at the center of a second trump term. what can we expect? >> we can expect you're going to be throwing people into gulags. are not exaggerating when i say that. there is the great story we're talking about this morning, we have people, i know people who when trump first got elected were like, i'm leaving the country. most of those people didn't leave the country. they once as a country houses in upstate new york, right? but you have people now who have been part of the resistance, or part of the biden administration, who are legitimately afraid if this man gets back into office, they have to leave. i'm not lying. i have friends who work here who have bought property in other countries because they are afraid being part of the media, you will be targeted by this man if he comes back into office. this is a terrible precedent. i said fascism. everyone here has that fascism, but i think people don't realize, they don't understand

what life could be like with a president who comes into office saying i'm getting revenge on everybody. i'm kicking down, waving the full floor, everyone who made me mad, everyone who sent out a tweet, everyone who spoke out against me, i will go after you. i will take your livelihood. i will put you or your families in jail. he's serious about that. i don't think people realize how seriously. is >> dr. jason johnson, coming in hot. good morning, as always, thank you. >> i didn't have to put my coffee in the microwave. he did that. >> we like to see it. >> he did it on. >> as we just mentioned, families are on edge and couples are inlaid after the alabama supreme court for the future of ivf in peril. why you're watching the weekend. y you're watching the weekend. from breaking your momentum. you may have already been vaccinated against the flu, but don't forget this season's updated covid-19 shot too. [cough] honey... honey. nyquil severe honey. powerful cold and flu relief with a dreamy honey taste nyquil honey,

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it feels like our infertility is being weaponized against us. i think we thought we had time. now, i am learning that maybe we don't. that's scary. >> to think of being this far in the process and it's just being ripped away, it's like a gut punch. so, yeah. i've literally cried the second i read it. >> people in the process of using in vitro fertilization as a way to become parents are terrified and their outraged after the alabama supreme court ruled that frozen embryos at the same rights as living

children. this means if anything goes wrong during the very intricate process of ivf, doctors, as well as patients, could face wrongful death lawsuits. here to help us break it all down is the freedom for all present, many timmaraju. many, in the aftermath of that alabama ruling, you had a number of republican elected officials in candidates speaking out and saying this is not what we believe. but republican arm that elect republicans to the senate put out a memo that said key messages are one, expressed support for ivf, post restrictions on idf, and expand campaign on creating access. to juxtapose that with the fact that there is a bill in congress right now, the life and consumption act, they should look at that man for kelly a conway a couple years ago. that feels from circulating, some version of that bill has been filed and circulating in congress for over a decade. mike johnson is the speaker, so

first of all, we already know. you talked to on his show, the connection to extremism and the very same organization that are pushing so-called personhood language. this is what this. as the life begins at conception, and all the ramifications. so, you've got this legislation. you've got over 100 republicans, the majority of their caucus, i believe, on this bill, and now, the running around saying oh my gosh, we support ivf. it's, like they'd like us to believe that they didn't know what they were doing. this seems to be the theme, right? tommy tuberville's interview was pretty startling. but they do know. they do know, and you can confirm. they've been working on this for decades in the republican party. >> the interesting thing, i think, minnie, it's the idea that we can undo dobbs. >> yes. >> and there are no downstream consequences from that. because once you do, and look, rightly, the discussion was

okay, the states will work this out and figure it out. and okay, that could be a policy or political debate. but you still can't take off the table the consequences, and ivf is one of the consequences. you have, for example, a lot of folks out there. you mentioned tuberville. there are others who do the how muhammad to homage are on this issue, but the issue is women, man -- >> yes. >> men, especially are like, timeout. what are you talking about? there is a coalition that has formed around this issue as a stand-alone from other aspects of abortion that i think are changing the political conversation. what do you find as you are tracking this across the country? because 83%, 83%, evangelicals in kellyanne's own polling, support ivf. >> right.

i think it's about taking the ideology, and i was digging through some of the heritage foundation and the project 2025 language this morning with my team. if you look at some of the ideology, i, mean it's inconsistent with the public positions, right? we've always known this. the majority of catholics want birth control, but the church does not support birth control. the catholic church is one of the biggest funders of anti abortion, anti-birth control efforts. when we have the big fight for over the counter birth control plan b, and it's all rooted in the concept of life at conception. if you are a true believer in that, if you're truly believe this, all of this is rational. all this makes sense, and you know, in 2011, in mississippi, there was a ballot in the should've to change their constitution and recognize fetal personhood. this, mississippi voters, to your point, resounded lee beat it back. , so we know the majority of americans, even conservative folks in red states like mississippi, over a decade ago,

rejected these philosophies. but as we know, the folks governing in a trump administration don't care about popular opinion. they don't care about democracy, don't care about what the majority of americans want. he is completely willing to get into bed with these extremists who want to impose the radical views on the rest of the country. >> that's absolutely right. at the same time, i find it fascinating that he is trying to do this sort of double dance, where he is both claiming credit for having overturned roe v. wade, but he understands this ivf thing is not popular. he's out with a statement on it. i want to know, you warned us about all of this, right? first, you warned us that, this is one of those times what you do hate to be right. you want about the overturn of roe. then, what was overturned, warned the risking to be downstream consequences, and people said oh, they're being hysterical. you weren't being hysterical. you are being accurate. now, we talk about the fact that they're not going to stop ivf. they're going to move on to contraception. we've already seen it when you talk about something like mifepristone and other access to abortion drugs.

what does the attack on contraception then look like? how do they get to contraception? >> so, we've talked a little bit about the new york times coverage, the political coverage, of this project 2025 blueprint. we know they're talking about bringing back and 1800s law, the comstock act, which is all about obscene materials in the mail. and that is a way they've explored getting passed, banning birth control, and medication abortion through the mail. and this mifepristone case that is going to oral arguments later this month in a couple of weeks as precisely about that. you know, right now, the fda has allowed mifepristone to be available in brick and mortar pharmacies, because we're dealing with this abortion crisis, folks and states, how are they supposed to get these medications if they can't get them through the mail, if they can't get them at brick and order? so, you're looking at things like reviving old legislation like comstock, using the entire

federal government to stop and halt, slow down access? these are all the many aggressions the way that they get to access, even with dobbs, which is why when the supreme court said dobbs is set in law, let's go to the states now, it was bush it. can i say that? >> then second delay. >> it was bs, because they knew they were setting themselves up for these fights. the other thing i thought was interesting, some clips of amy coney barrett's testimony in the senate have been emerging again. >> about ivf. >> where are really big champions of reproductive freedom, if you don't know, richard blumenthal grilled her and trying to get around ivf and personhood, and she would not commit. and it dobbs, there's a whole footnote on personhood, and life at conception. it's right there in all the heritage foundation plans for a trump administration. so, come on, folks. >> yeah. >> it's right there in front of us. >> and chief justice, i mean, justice clarence thomas has

already laid the predicate for contraception issue to come before the court. >> so we need to take this seriously. when people tell you who they are, believe them. when the supreme court writes a majority opinion, bring it. thanks, mirage you, thank you very, very much. tomorrow, folks, we are going to discuss this ruling with jennifer klein. she's the chair of the two your policy council at the white house. stick with us, okay? grab another cup of coffee, because we do have another jam- packed hour to get your day started, including south carolina james clyburn, -- panelist mary mccord, and have posted some julia ioffe. you're watching the weekend. ju. you're watching the weekend.

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